Finishing and getting fouled like Monta Ellis

I posted the "square in the air" question here: viewtopic.php?f=68&t=271

Thanks

Those are great goals Ben.... and IF you keep working at it, you will have a good chance of achieving them.

Its nice that your dad works with you... and that you have a friend to shoot around with also.

Keep up the good work... and you didn't answer my question about what positions you play in little league... I guessed Shortstop and Pitcher.

Ken

oh, sorry, In baseball i play all the positions but usually center and pitcher. Not short because im a lefty.

Right now i am having a problem with backspin. My dad has told me to put my index finger on the middle of the ball for hand placement.

He is a really good shooter. He has experimented with hand placement and found that index finger in the middle works the best.

I have also experimented but nothin has gotten good backspin. Have you heard of a problem with backspin if youre hand is to small.

I still make most of my shots but i know you need good backspin.

I'm certainly not saying that your dad is wrong.. because it works for him... and you can adjust the ball wherever you want it from the free throw line - but during games we don't have the luxury of looking for finger placement...... We look the ball into our hands and bring the ball to the triple threat after catching a pass. We are now looking to shoot, pass or drive.
I was a decent shooter and I don't remember having a great deal of backspin... some one told me that I had a lazy wrist. Do you have too much OFF hand on the ball? Are you flipping your wrist down on the follow through? (although I heard George Lehman talk a several clinics and he never emphasized back spin)
Certainly the size of your hand has a lot to do with what you can do with the ball... as a kid I always wanted to palm the ball... sure, I was 4'11' at 13 years old and a freshman... that wasn't going to happen.
I'm going to do a search on this for you and see what I come up with... here is the first thing I found:

In adjusting his/her hands preparatory to shooting, the shooter should space the fingers comfortably to hold the ball firmly in his/her fingertips and on the heels of both hands. The palms are held slightly clear and the three middle fingers aligned perpendicular to the seams. Players should practice their feel of this until this adjustment becomes instinctive as soon as they catch a ball.

Ken

Ok, Well I have thought maybe my off hand was a probllem but Ive been working on making sure it comes off during the shot but I am going to do some research too.

Also, where do you find your articles on basketball?

Here are some more tips Ben,

4. The Shot - Your shooting action begins the moment you are in set position. Shooting is a one-piece action in which you quickly jump and uncock the wrist. This quick jumping action generates most of the power for the shot. The feet barely leave the floor. As the hand comes forward as the wrist is uncocked, the ball immediately begins to rise up on the fingertips. Quick wrist action and fingertip control give a crisp back spin to the ball. For maximum control of the ball, it should come off the tips of the forefinger and middle finger. To transfer power from the legs to the ball, release the ball just as, or just before, you complete your jumping action. Make sure the ball leaves the fingertips before the arm straightens in follow through. As the shooting arm straightens in follow through, the wrist should end up only slightly ahead of the elbow, which should not be tightly locked. The hand will have completed its full range of motion from being cocked back to being crisply snapped forward. Throughout the entire shooting action, keep your eyes focussed on a spot on the back of the rim directly opposite you; stay relaxed so that all the joints, particularly the wrist of the shooting hand, move very easily. Key Basketball Shooting Tip: The stronger your legs, the better your jump shot.

There is a picture on this site for proper hand placement:
Click here: The Shooting Coach (Fundamentals Basketball Academy)

There is a video on You tube for hand placement:
Click here: YouTube - Basketball Shooting Surfaces - How to Shoot Video Blog (Watch in HD)

NOW, this seems like a lot of information which could just confuse you.... so get your self comfortable with your shot.... as long as it is fundamentally sound..... it seems like you just need to flip your wrist more. Again, I am not there to see it....so look at this hand placement.... read this suff and move on..... I sure don't want to mess your shot up. Let me know what you think.

Ken

maybe i have a lazy wrist like you. But i watched the swish video that says that you should have a relaxed wrist. Does that still mean you should still have some wrist action. I have my elbow under the ball and i use a little bit open stance. My finger placement on free throws is the index finger in the middle. I heard that Pete Maravich also had his index finger in the middle of the ball.

Its pretty simple to find things... just type whatever you are looking for in your search engine.. google or whatever and it should bring up several links to what you want.

As for your off hand... it should be pretty much FLAT ... and just along side the ball... making sure it doesn't fall off the shooting hand....

This is how I approached teaching shooting in our camps.
We taught BEEF
Balance
Elbow under the ball
Eye on the target
Follow through

I started every kid doing this... 3 feet from the basket...OFF hand behind your back.... good balance.... one dribble with your shooting hand... bring the ball up making sure your elbow is under the ball and the ball is sitting in your hand in the proper position.... bring the ball up... shooting it and putting your hand in the cookie jar (flipping your wrist) and holding the follow through... we did this from the left. the middle. and the right... working our way back out a few more feet.

Then we added the non shooting hand.. but NOT on the ball... this forces you to be fundamentally sound with your form... after doing this for a few minutes we added the NON shooting hand making sure that it wasn;t being used while releasing the ball.

Does this help?

Ken

yes

Check this for hand placement Ben...

There is a video on You tube for hand placement:
Click here: YouTube - Basketball Shooting Surfaces - How to Shoot Video Blog (Watch in HD)

Let me know how this looks to you.

AND if you could put the swish video link on here I will take a look at it... or is it something you bought?

Ken

I got the dvd from the library. It is Tom Nordlands dvd. It teaches that the shooting hand should be in line with the shooting eye and that the the shooting elbow does not have to be under the ball. It also teaches high arc 45-60 degrees and that the wrist should be floppy and the shot is a push not a flip. I took somethings from this video and combined it with other things I learned over the years. I took the open stance, 45 degree arc and floppy wrist and combined it with elbow under the the ball.

Ive seen that video before Shotscience.

You can find some clips of the swish dvd on youtube just search swishcoach.

Did the video help? I know that the elbow is not exactly under the ball but I think you get the idea about having your elbow in the correct position... and if you try the one handed approach I gave you it will show you how important it is.

I like your approach of using things that work for you.. as long as you stay funamentally sound.

I've seen a few coaches teach shooting and I don't like their approach..... so I do what works for me and while I was coaching... my program.

Make adjustments as you need to and it will improve your game.

Ken

I have always shot 1 handed but next time i go shoot around ill try your sequence of shooting starting with the off hand away from the ball. Im actually going to shoot around with my friend tomorrow.

Also Tom Nordlands site is swish22.com if you wanted to check it out.

With the wrist should it be flat on the follow through or bending down?

Let me know if that helps you - hopefully it will help you with the back spin too.

I think my hand was more flat on the follow through rather than flipping it... BUT I taught the flip because it gave more back spin.

So my advice is to do what works for you... what feels comfortable AND more importantly... what gives you the most positive results. Sometimes we have to change to get better.

Ok thanks

What was a good arc for you and what was your target of the basket?