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PostPosted: 27 Jan 2014, 10:56 

Posts: 15
Good morning everyone!
Jeff, thanks for this email.
This really hits home based on recent games we have had and my reactions and thoughts -post game.
"
I'm sure other coaches will chime in about this. Personally I have found that the majority of officiating at the youth to freshman level is pretty bad. Even sometimes at the varsity level it can be bad but it's usually pretty decent by that point. That's just how it is.

I have also found that some refs are very defensive. I mean sometimes if you're just asking a question they get all red in the face. You can't even talk with them.

I'm not a very good "game coach". So I probably should say a whole lot. I'm really good at player development and a decent practice coach. In games I mostly hope I prepared them good enough and do my best with adjustments, etc.


Now with that said, if I truly thought my players were in danger of getting hurt and it's that out of hand (especially with youth players), I'd probably call a time out and as calmly as possible talk to the refs. I'd tell them I could care less about winning or getting the calls my way. I'm just worried that the way the other team is physically shoving that someone is going to get hurt and get out of hand. You can call travels on us every time down the court. But if you could call some fouls on the shoving, that would be great. I just don't want anyone to get hurt or retaliate."


Last Saturday we had our final out of conference game. We have wrapped up 2nd place in our division and the game was meaningless apart from the win/loss record.

The teams were fairly evenly matched and we traded lead throughout the first half. The second half became an indoor football game with my players usually on the bad end.
The other coach is known for yelling calls “He’s walking, ..”That’s a foul…!...”and yelling “slap at the ball! to his players on defense and also for teaching his players to be very aggressive. I gave up trying to count all the hand checking, body checks, defenders arm draped over the ball handlers shoulder…. I tried my best to remain quiet and speak only to my players…but after my point guard was tripped by the defender and he was called for walking and later pretty much clothes-lined into losing the ball, I felt I had to say something to the officials. For the first time…and one of them looked at me and said “Let us ref the game, coach.” Really? the other coach has been yelling and screaming all game.

I had to remind the officials twice that it was a one- and one situation after a foul on them, and to take the cake, in the 4th we were behind maybe 3 points and so decided to apply half-court pressure.
My guard attacked their point and caused and over and back, our ball, right?. The opposing coach called a time out. I spoke to my players, sent them back out on the floor, turned to the bench to put my marker board down, turned back around and the official was handing the OTHER team the ball!
When I protested, he said that there had been another play after the timeout. Uhhh no, if that was the case why was the ball being inbounded at the same spot as prior to the over and back call? Needless to say, they scored on that play and we never recovered.
Sigh… thanks for letting me vent. 

Mark
Coach
12UB Nuggets


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PostPosted: 27 Jan 2014, 11:43 
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Sounds like there was a little home cooking .... not to mention the fact ( like you said ) that typically youth refs are not very good.

It sounds like you handled yourself very good considering.... especially that last backcourt violation. The advantage we had at the varity high school level was the official scorers and time keepers etc. We would be able to have the refs check that IF the 3 officials on the game got it wrong.

It does happen, even at our level. We lost a game because one of the officials administered the ball under our basket instead of the side line.... they scored and we lost by one. After the officials came out of their locker room, the one official came up to me and apoligized for the mistake and costing us the game... but if you think about it... there are a lot of things going on during games that can cost you the game..

As coaches, all we can do is to take care of the things we have control over. Don't get me wrong, with the physical things that were going on, I too would have reminded them about taking care of the kids, its their responsibility to make sure they don't get hurt. ( along with the coaches )

As for defensive refs.... try to develop a good relationship with them and it will be a lot easier to talk to them

Good luck


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PostPosted: 27 Jan 2014, 11:51 

Posts: 15
Thanks Coach Sar!

Mark


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PostPosted: 28 Jan 2014, 11:47 

Posts: 899
Sounds like a rough game with the officials. Safety is a big concern these days, especially with concussions taking more of a forefront in the headlines. If you put the officials on notice that you're concerned about the safety of ALL the players, most of them with respond and take more control of the game.

The other thing you can do is file a complaint with their organization. I've only filed 2 formal complaints over the past ten years. One was over safety issues where an official didn't take control of the game after me asking twice and someone ended up getting hurt when it could have been avoided. The other one had to do with a ref talking smack to my kids. Literally critiquing their play along with calling a foul. "That was terrible defense!" etc...

On the flip side, I remember being in a game last year (we were playing up a level) and looking up at the foul count seeing 10 for us and 1 for the other team. First reaction was to claim the refs were being one-sided and biased. At half, I brought up the 10 vs 1 foul situation to one of the refs. His reply? "Tell your kids to quit fouling" He was right, we couldn't keep up with their guys so we were putting out hands, grabbing, etc.

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PostPosted: 28 Jan 2014, 16:51 
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Coach Rob wrote:
On the flip side, I remember being in a game last year (we were playing up a level) and looking up at the foul count seeing 10 for us and 1 for the other team. First reaction was to claim the refs were being one-sided and biased. At half, I brought up the 10 vs 1 foul situation to one of the refs. His reply? "Tell your kids to quit fouling" He was right, we couldn't keep up with their guys so we were putting out hands, grabbing, etc.


There are times when the refs ARE doing a little home cooking. 8th grade game, fouls were 18-1 at half time. I looked at the book and questioned him.... he said we are being fair.... 18-1? He gave me this funny look.... we still won that game.

Varsity high school game.... our side of the scoreboard was all lit up and their side... a couple of lights,,, ny asst, said to the scoreres table AFTER all the lights went out in the gym..... sorry we are fouling so much that we caused that brown out. He earned a T from the refs and some laughs from me... we lost that game.

Coach Rob wrote:
The other thing you can do is file a complaint with their organization. I've only filed 2 formal complaints over the past ten years. One was over safety issues where an official didn't take control of the game after me asking twice and someone ended up getting hurt when it could have been avoided. The other one had to do with a ref talking smack to my kids. Literally critiquing their play along with calling a foul. "That was terrible defense!" etc...


Most of the time there are assignemtent chair people for all the rers, you can file a complaint but you better have all your ducks in a row. Kids getting hurt is where I draw the line.... as for taking smack, I would ask him to refer his somments to me and NOT my players.


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PostPosted: 03 Feb 2014, 19:07 
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Coaches: Whew!! certainly a ton of emotions when discussing refereeing...My take on this is...every coach should at one time referee and every referee should coach. I have done both, I have coached for 35 yesrs and during that tenure, also refereed for about 20 years. In my opinion, no referee knowingly cheats rather, some are just simply incompetant. When I refereed, I gave respect to coaches; however, if a coach is a yeller, screamer who's main intention is to embarrass me, then I simply shut him off. I have never said to any coach, "read the rules" or came back with a sarcastic remark. As a referee, when I got the time, I would listen intently to what a coac had to say, as log as it was said with respect. If I missed a call, I would honestly say to a coach; "coach you may be right, I may have missed that one, but I wont miss it again That usually calms many coaches down. Nothing wrong with saying you blew a call. Coaches appreciate that. Now with the two you had, younger and elder, the younger has no business making snyde comments during play and needs to be reported. All referees are under the scrutiny of more experienced supervising referees. These supervisors rely on reports from coaches to make decisions on who gets the big games and who watches from the sidelines. On the other hand Coach, your actions on the sidelines were also certainly not called for. I realize you were upset, but you need to keep your emotions in check. If you felt you were cheated out of a win, keep that to yourself, and do report the official to the supervisor. that is your best option. Hopefully this hels Coach Mac.


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